<?xml version="1.0" encoding="UTF-8"?><rss version="2.0"
	xmlns:content="http://purl.org/rss/1.0/modules/content/"
	xmlns:dc="http://purl.org/dc/elements/1.1/"
	xmlns:atom="http://www.w3.org/2005/Atom"
	xmlns:sy="http://purl.org/rss/1.0/modules/syndication/"
		>
<channel>
	<title>Comments on: We&#8217;re alone in these trenches, Nick</title>
	<atom:link href="http://www.climateconversation.wordshine.co.nz/2010/06/were-alone-in-these-trenches-nick/feed/" rel="self" type="application/rss+xml" />
	<link>http://www.climateconversation.wordshine.co.nz/2010/06/were-alone-in-these-trenches-nick/</link>
	<description>Taking the heat out of global warming</description>
	<lastBuildDate>Fri, 10 Feb 2012 08:26:16 +0000</lastBuildDate>
	<sy:updatePeriod>hourly</sy:updatePeriod>
	<sy:updateFrequency>1</sy:updateFrequency>
	<generator>http://wordpress.org/?v=3.3.1</generator>
	<item>
		<title>By: Andy</title>
		<link>http://www.climateconversation.wordshine.co.nz/2010/06/were-alone-in-these-trenches-nick/comment-page-1/#comment-22798</link>
		<dc:creator>Andy</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 21 Jun 2010 07:20:20 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.climateconversation.wordshine.co.nz/?p=5705#comment-22798</guid>
		<description>I&#039;ve just had some further dialogue with MFE regarding the emissions targets I quoted in the above link.

These are &quot;responsibility&quot; targets rather than domestic targets.

I.e they are not targets that we can necessarily achieve (and by the governments own admission we will not achieve them)

We can purchase credits on the international carbon market to make up the shortfall. 

I have asked for some ballpark figures on what this shortfall might be. I presume a lot depends on whether we sign our lives away at some future &quot;Copenhagen&quot; type summit.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I&#8217;ve just had some further dialogue with MFE regarding the emissions targets I quoted in the above link.</p>
<p>These are &#8220;responsibility&#8221; targets rather than domestic targets.</p>
<p>I.e they are not targets that we can necessarily achieve (and by the governments own admission we will not achieve them)</p>
<p>We can purchase credits on the international carbon market to make up the shortfall. </p>
<p>I have asked for some ballpark figures on what this shortfall might be. I presume a lot depends on whether we sign our lives away at some future &#8220;Copenhagen&#8221; type summit.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Andy</title>
		<link>http://www.climateconversation.wordshine.co.nz/2010/06/were-alone-in-these-trenches-nick/comment-page-1/#comment-22797</link>
		<dc:creator>Andy</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 21 Jun 2010 01:02:37 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.climateconversation.wordshine.co.nz/?p=5705#comment-22797</guid>
		<description>If you look at Fig 1.3 on the following webpage, you can see projected emissions with and without ETS 

http://www.mfe.govt.nz/publications/climate/nz-fifth-national-communication/page2.html

Without ETS, emissions are forecast to increase from around 78000Gg CO2 to around 85,000Gg CO2,

With ETS, emissions are forecast to stay roughly constant at the 2010 levels until 2020

This, of course, falls somewhat outside the range of a 10% target reduction of emissions by 2020. The 2050 target of 50% reduction looks like a pipe-dream at this stage.

As to the question of how much the percentage of global emissions will be in 2020, we can safely assume that it will be less than 2010 figures as the developing world is rapidly increasing emissions levels. e.g China adds an amount equivalent to a whole NZ&#039;s worth of emissions every 3 or 4 weeks or so.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>If you look at Fig 1.3 on the following webpage, you can see projected emissions with and without ETS </p>
<p><a href="http://www.mfe.govt.nz/publications/climate/nz-fifth-national-communication/page2.html" rel="nofollow">http://www.mfe.govt.nz/publications/climate/nz-fifth-national-communication/page2.html</a></p>
<p>Without ETS, emissions are forecast to increase from around 78000Gg CO2 to around 85,000Gg CO2,</p>
<p>With ETS, emissions are forecast to stay roughly constant at the 2010 levels until 2020</p>
<p>This, of course, falls somewhat outside the range of a 10% target reduction of emissions by 2020. The 2050 target of 50% reduction looks like a pipe-dream at this stage.</p>
<p>As to the question of how much the percentage of global emissions will be in 2020, we can safely assume that it will be less than 2010 figures as the developing world is rapidly increasing emissions levels. e.g China adds an amount equivalent to a whole NZ&#8217;s worth of emissions every 3 or 4 weeks or so.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Richard Treadgold</title>
		<link>http://www.climateconversation.wordshine.co.nz/2010/06/were-alone-in-these-trenches-nick/comment-page-1/#comment-22796</link>
		<dc:creator>Richard Treadgold</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 20 Jun 2010 23:54:02 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.climateconversation.wordshine.co.nz/?p=5705#comment-22796</guid>
		<description>Somebody? **click fingers** Somebody?

Anybody?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Somebody? **click fingers** Somebody?</p>
<p>Anybody?</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Clarence</title>
		<link>http://www.climateconversation.wordshine.co.nz/2010/06/were-alone-in-these-trenches-nick/comment-page-1/#comment-22792</link>
		<dc:creator>Clarence</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 20 Jun 2010 19:11:07 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.climateconversation.wordshine.co.nz/?p=5705#comment-22792</guid>
		<description>If New Zealand has been contributing 0.2% of the greenhouse gas concentration in the earth&#039;s atmosphere before entering into an ETS – what percentage will we be contributing AFTER entering into an ETS?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>If New Zealand has been contributing 0.2% of the greenhouse gas concentration in the earth&#8217;s atmosphere before entering into an ETS – what percentage will we be contributing AFTER entering into an ETS?</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Andy</title>
		<link>http://www.climateconversation.wordshine.co.nz/2010/06/were-alone-in-these-trenches-nick/comment-page-1/#comment-22671</link>
		<dc:creator>Andy</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 08 Jun 2010 19:35:39 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.climateconversation.wordshine.co.nz/?p=5705#comment-22671</guid>
		<description>Slightly off-topic, but this paper is worth a read:

&quot;Global Warming Advocacy Science: a Cross Examination&quot;

http://www.probeinternational.org/UPennCross.pdf

Quote from above:

&lt;em&gt;Given, however, that the most significant ghg emission reduction policies are
intended to completely alter the basic fuel sources upon which industrial economies and
societies are based, with the costs uncertain but potentially in the many trillions of
dollars, one would suppose that before such policies are undertaken, it would be
worthwhile to verify that the climate establishment’s view really does reflect an unbiased
and objective assessment of the current state of climate science.&lt;/em&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Slightly off-topic, but this paper is worth a read:</p>
<p>&#8220;Global Warming Advocacy Science: a Cross Examination&#8221;</p>
<p><a href="http://www.probeinternational.org/UPennCross.pdf" rel="nofollow">http://www.probeinternational.org/UPennCross.pdf</a></p>
<p>Quote from above:</p>
<p><em>Given, however, that the most significant ghg emission reduction policies are<br />
intended to completely alter the basic fuel sources upon which industrial economies and<br />
societies are based, with the costs uncertain but potentially in the many trillions of<br />
dollars, one would suppose that before such policies are undertaken, it would be<br />
worthwhile to verify that the climate establishment’s view really does reflect an unbiased<br />
and objective assessment of the current state of climate science.</em></p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Richard Treadgold</title>
		<link>http://www.climateconversation.wordshine.co.nz/2010/06/were-alone-in-these-trenches-nick/comment-page-1/#comment-22627</link>
		<dc:creator>Richard Treadgold</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 03 Jun 2010 01:07:53 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.climateconversation.wordshine.co.nz/?p=5705#comment-22627</guid>
		<description>Brilliant.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Brilliant.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Richard Treadgold</title>
		<link>http://www.climateconversation.wordshine.co.nz/2010/06/were-alone-in-these-trenches-nick/comment-page-1/#comment-22626</link>
		<dc:creator>Richard Treadgold</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 03 Jun 2010 01:07:04 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.climateconversation.wordshine.co.nz/?p=5705#comment-22626</guid>
		<description>**sigh**</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>**sigh**</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Bob D</title>
		<link>http://www.climateconversation.wordshine.co.nz/2010/06/were-alone-in-these-trenches-nick/comment-page-1/#comment-22625</link>
		<dc:creator>Bob D</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 03 Jun 2010 00:14:47 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.climateconversation.wordshine.co.nz/?p=5705#comment-22625</guid>
		<description>I was somewhat bemused when I read Nick Smith&#039;s comment.  The parallels between Gallipoli and the ETS are in fact quite strong, but not the way he intended.  

I think you&#039;ll battle to find anyone who disagrees that Gallipoli was an &lt;a href=&quot;http://www.historylearningsite.co.uk/gallipoli.htm&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;unmitigated disaster&lt;/a&gt;.  The ANZAC troops were marched unwittingly into a fiasco because they blindingly trusted the Allied commanders at the time.  They were prepared to &quot;do their fair share&quot; based on very little analysis.  They paid for it with their blood, and the end result was: nothing.  Absolutely nothing was achieved; they eventually had to pull out, leaving the best of their generation dead on the beaches.

Much like the ETS, really.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I was somewhat bemused when I read Nick Smith&#8217;s comment.  The parallels between Gallipoli and the ETS are in fact quite strong, but not the way he intended.  </p>
<p>I think you&#8217;ll battle to find anyone who disagrees that Gallipoli was an <a href="http://www.historylearningsite.co.uk/gallipoli.htm" rel="nofollow">unmitigated disaster</a>.  The ANZAC troops were marched unwittingly into a fiasco because they blindingly trusted the Allied commanders at the time.  They were prepared to &#8220;do their fair share&#8221; based on very little analysis.  They paid for it with their blood, and the end result was: nothing.  Absolutely nothing was achieved; they eventually had to pull out, leaving the best of their generation dead on the beaches.</p>
<p>Much like the ETS, really.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Andy</title>
		<link>http://www.climateconversation.wordshine.co.nz/2010/06/were-alone-in-these-trenches-nick/comment-page-1/#comment-22623</link>
		<dc:creator>Andy</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 02 Jun 2010 22:01:36 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.climateconversation.wordshine.co.nz/?p=5705#comment-22623</guid>
		<description>A better analogy would be trying to swim upstream in a raging torrent.

NZs annual net CO2 emissions are around 50 million tonnes

The South African Medusi coal station that has just been granted funding by the world bank will emit 25 million tonnes per annum.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/business/2010/apr/09/world-bank-criticised-over-power-station

In other words, this one power station will emit 50% of NZ&#039;s entire CO2 emissions in the same time period.

Plus we have China, who are committed to building a new coal fired power station every week until 2020.

If this is our Gallipoli, then the war is already lost.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>A better analogy would be trying to swim upstream in a raging torrent.</p>
<p>NZs annual net CO2 emissions are around 50 million tonnes</p>
<p>The South African Medusi coal station that has just been granted funding by the world bank will emit 25 million tonnes per annum.</p>
<p><a href="http://www.guardian.co.uk/business/2010/apr/09/world-bank-criticised-over-power-station" rel="nofollow">http://www.guardian.co.uk/business/2010/apr/09/world-bank-criticised-over-power-station</a></p>
<p>In other words, this one power station will emit 50% of NZ&#8217;s entire CO2 emissions in the same time period.</p>
<p>Plus we have China, who are committed to building a new coal fired power station every week until 2020.</p>
<p>If this is our Gallipoli, then the war is already lost.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
</channel>
</rss>

