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	<title>Comments on: ETS threatened by carbon price collapse</title>
	<atom:link href="http://www.climateconversation.wordshine.co.nz/2011/11/ets-threatened-by-carbon-price-collapse/feed/" rel="self" type="application/rss+xml" />
	<link>http://www.climateconversation.wordshine.co.nz/2011/11/ets-threatened-by-carbon-price-collapse/</link>
	<description>Taking the heat out of global warming</description>
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		<title>By: QuentinF</title>
		<link>http://www.climateconversation.wordshine.co.nz/2011/11/ets-threatened-by-carbon-price-collapse/comment-page-1/#comment-72085</link>
		<dc:creator>QuentinF</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 27 Nov 2011 06:11:07 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.climateconversation.wordshine.co.nz/?p=11974#comment-72085</guid>
		<description>I see the ecofascists got 13 seats hrrumf!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I see the ecofascists got 13 seats hrrumf!</p>
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		<title>By: PeterM</title>
		<link>http://www.climateconversation.wordshine.co.nz/2011/11/ets-threatened-by-carbon-price-collapse/comment-page-1/#comment-72071</link>
		<dc:creator>PeterM</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 27 Nov 2011 01:42:35 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.climateconversation.wordshine.co.nz/?p=11974#comment-72071</guid>
		<description>&quot;PLANET UNDER THREAT
The stakes are growing increasingly high, with many experts calling for immediate action.&quot;
http://nz.news.yahoo.com/a/-/world/12044852/time-running-out-for-deal-on-global-warming-at-climate-talks/

A carnival spirit filled Durban&#039;s streets on Friday when scores of people took part in a parade to welcome climate change conference delegates. ... Labour concedes defeat in New Zealand ...
http://www.timeslive.co.za/scitech/2011/11/25/green-parade-in-durban-greets-cop-17

Use your bicycle or skateboard to get to work monday!

Who are the NZ delegates?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;PLANET UNDER THREAT<br />
The stakes are growing increasingly high, with many experts calling for immediate action.&#8221;<br />
<a href="http://nz.news.yahoo.com/a/-/world/12044852/time-running-out-for-deal-on-global-warming-at-climate-talks/" rel="nofollow">http://nz.news.yahoo.com/a/-/world/12044852/time-running-out-for-deal-on-global-warming-at-climate-talks/</a></p>
<p>A carnival spirit filled Durban&#8217;s streets on Friday when scores of people took part in a parade to welcome climate change conference delegates. &#8230; Labour concedes defeat in New Zealand &#8230;<br />
<a href="http://www.timeslive.co.za/scitech/2011/11/25/green-parade-in-durban-greets-cop-17" rel="nofollow">http://www.timeslive.co.za/scitech/2011/11/25/green-parade-in-durban-greets-cop-17</a></p>
<p>Use your bicycle or skateboard to get to work monday!</p>
<p>Who are the NZ delegates?</p>
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	<item>
		<title>By: Clarence</title>
		<link>http://www.climateconversation.wordshine.co.nz/2011/11/ets-threatened-by-carbon-price-collapse/comment-page-1/#comment-71971</link>
		<dc:creator>Clarence</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 26 Nov 2011 00:34:33 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.climateconversation.wordshine.co.nz/?p=11974#comment-71971</guid>
		<description>The Labour Party&#039;s &quot;Fiscal Statement&quot; says it would earn extra net revenue of $218 million per annum from the inclusion of the agriculture sector.

Dragging this amount out of the returns to livestock farmers would trigger a round of foreclosures such as the country has never before experienced.

In the last &quot;bad year&quot; (2008-9) aggregate after-tax profits for the entire livestock farming  industry in New Zealand were $462 million.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The Labour Party&#8217;s &#8220;Fiscal Statement&#8221; says it would earn extra net revenue of $218 million per annum from the inclusion of the agriculture sector.</p>
<p>Dragging this amount out of the returns to livestock farmers would trigger a round of foreclosures such as the country has never before experienced.</p>
<p>In the last &#8220;bad year&#8221; (2008-9) aggregate after-tax profits for the entire livestock farming  industry in New Zealand were $462 million.</p>
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		<title>By: Australis</title>
		<link>http://www.climateconversation.wordshine.co.nz/2011/11/ets-threatened-by-carbon-price-collapse/comment-page-1/#comment-71969</link>
		<dc:creator>Australis</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 26 Nov 2011 00:26:01 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.climateconversation.wordshine.co.nz/?p=11974#comment-71969</guid>
		<description>&quot;The Australian&quot; ($) reports on Wednesday:

&quot;Swiss banking giant UBS says the European Union&#039;s emission trading scheme has cost the continent&#039;s consumers $287 billion for &quot;almost zero impact&quot; on cutting carbon emissions, and has warned that the EU&#039;s carbon pricing market is on the verge of a collapse next year.

&quot;In a damning report to cients, UBS (a major carbon trader) says had the E210bn the scheme had cost consumers been used instead in a targeted approach to replace the EU&#039;s dirtiest power plants, emissions could have been reduced by 43%..&quot;

Describing the ETS as having &quot;limited benefits and embarassing consequences&quot;, the report said there was fading political support for the scheme .. and it had provided windfall profits to market participants, paid for by electricity consumers.&quot;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;The Australian&#8221; ($) reports on Wednesday:</p>
<p>&#8220;Swiss banking giant UBS says the European Union&#8217;s emission trading scheme has cost the continent&#8217;s consumers $287 billion for &#8220;almost zero impact&#8221; on cutting carbon emissions, and has warned that the EU&#8217;s carbon pricing market is on the verge of a collapse next year.</p>
<p>&#8220;In a damning report to cients, UBS (a major carbon trader) says had the E210bn the scheme had cost consumers been used instead in a targeted approach to replace the EU&#8217;s dirtiest power plants, emissions could have been reduced by 43%..&#8221;</p>
<p>Describing the ETS as having &#8220;limited benefits and embarassing consequences&#8221;, the report said there was fading political support for the scheme .. and it had provided windfall profits to market participants, paid for by electricity consumers.&#8221;</p>
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		<title>By: Richard C (NZ)</title>
		<link>http://www.climateconversation.wordshine.co.nz/2011/11/ets-threatened-by-carbon-price-collapse/comment-page-1/#comment-71956</link>
		<dc:creator>Richard C (NZ)</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 25 Nov 2011 21:32:05 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.climateconversation.wordshine.co.nz/?p=11974#comment-71956</guid>
		<description>ETS carbon trading must be the only market in the world that operates with wholesale prices higher than retail prices.

[Afterthought: except the odd IPO of course]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>ETS carbon trading must be the only market in the world that operates with wholesale prices higher than retail prices.</p>
<p>[Afterthought: except the odd IPO of course]</p>
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		<title>By: Richard C (NZ)</title>
		<link>http://www.climateconversation.wordshine.co.nz/2011/11/ets-threatened-by-carbon-price-collapse/comment-page-1/#comment-71955</link>
		<dc:creator>Richard C (NZ)</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 25 Nov 2011 21:27:18 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.climateconversation.wordshine.co.nz/?p=11974#comment-71955</guid>
		<description>Interesting article Bulaman. I hadn&#039;t come across this scam before (emphasized):-

&quot;.......scandals in the EU emissions trading scheme, including carbon permit theft, tax fraud, &lt;em&gt;&lt;strong&gt;re-use of U.N. carbon credits&lt;/strong&gt;&lt;/em&gt; and internet scams&quot;

Still, recycling is a green initiative - why not apply the concept to other green initiatives?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Interesting article Bulaman. I hadn&#8217;t come across this scam before (emphasized):-</p>
<p>&#8220;&#8230;&#8230;.scandals in the EU emissions trading scheme, including carbon permit theft, tax fraud, <em><strong>re-use of U.N. carbon credits</strong></em> and internet scams&#8221;</p>
<p>Still, recycling is a green initiative &#8211; why not apply the concept to other green initiatives?</p>
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		<title>By: Andy</title>
		<link>http://www.climateconversation.wordshine.co.nz/2011/11/ets-threatened-by-carbon-price-collapse/comment-page-1/#comment-71954</link>
		<dc:creator>Andy</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 25 Nov 2011 21:02:17 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.climateconversation.wordshine.co.nz/?p=11974#comment-71954</guid>
		<description>EURef also reports a similar story

&lt;em&gt;the eventual price expected to bottom out as low as €3, having already dropped to €5.26 for the December 2011 contract.&lt;/em&gt;

http://eureferendum.blogspot.com/2011/11/collapse-of-policy.html</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>EURef also reports a similar story</p>
<p><em>the eventual price expected to bottom out as low as €3, having already dropped to €5.26 for the December 2011 contract.</em></p>
<p><a href="http://eureferendum.blogspot.com/2011/11/collapse-of-policy.html" rel="nofollow">http://eureferendum.blogspot.com/2011/11/collapse-of-policy.html</a></p>
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		<title>By: Bulaman</title>
		<link>http://www.climateconversation.wordshine.co.nz/2011/11/ets-threatened-by-carbon-price-collapse/comment-page-1/#comment-71910</link>
		<dc:creator>Bulaman</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 25 Nov 2011 09:55:24 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.climateconversation.wordshine.co.nz/?p=11974#comment-71910</guid>
		<description>As they come tumblin down..



http://www.reuters.com/article/2011/11/22/us-carbon-climate-idUSTRE7AL1GE20111122</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>As they come tumblin down..</p>
<p><a href="http://www.reuters.com/article/2011/11/22/us-carbon-climate-idUSTRE7AL1GE20111122" rel="nofollow">http://www.reuters.com/article/2011/11/22/us-carbon-climate-idUSTRE7AL1GE20111122</a></p>
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		<title>By: PeterM</title>
		<link>http://www.climateconversation.wordshine.co.nz/2011/11/ets-threatened-by-carbon-price-collapse/comment-page-1/#comment-71909</link>
		<dc:creator>PeterM</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 25 Nov 2011 09:53:47 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.climateconversation.wordshine.co.nz/?p=11974#comment-71909</guid>
		<description>Ouch!

Carbon Waste from the Australian
http://www.theaustralian.com.au/national-affairs/europes-287bn-carbon-waste-ubs-report/story-fn59niix-1226203068972

From the Herald
Labour, however, is counting on a revenue stream - a cumulative $680 million over the next four years - to partially defray the cost of its tax policy.

From http://www.asiaone.com/News/Latest%2BNews/Asia/Story/A1Story20111125-312526.html
Climate Change Minister Nick Smith has said if re-elected National will slow down the expansion of the ETS, keep the NZ$25 a tonne price cap until 2015, but wait until 2014 before deciding whether the agricultural sector, which accounts for around half of the country&#039;s carbon emissions, will be included in the ETS.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Ouch!</p>
<p>Carbon Waste from the Australian<br />
<a href="http://www.theaustralian.com.au/national-affairs/europes-287bn-carbon-waste-ubs-report/story-fn59niix-1226203068972" rel="nofollow">http://www.theaustralian.com.au/national-affairs/europes-287bn-carbon-waste-ubs-report/story-fn59niix-1226203068972</a></p>
<p>From the Herald<br />
Labour, however, is counting on a revenue stream &#8211; a cumulative $680 million over the next four years &#8211; to partially defray the cost of its tax policy.</p>
<p>From <a href="http://www.asiaone.com/News/Latest%2BNews/Asia/Story/A1Story20111125-312526.html" rel="nofollow">http://www.asiaone.com/News/Latest%2BNews/Asia/Story/A1Story20111125-312526.html</a><br />
Climate Change Minister Nick Smith has said if re-elected National will slow down the expansion of the ETS, keep the NZ$25 a tonne price cap until 2015, but wait until 2014 before deciding whether the agricultural sector, which accounts for around half of the country&#8217;s carbon emissions, will be included in the ETS.</p>
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		<title>By: bulaman</title>
		<link>http://www.climateconversation.wordshine.co.nz/2011/11/ets-threatened-by-carbon-price-collapse/comment-page-1/#comment-71886</link>
		<dc:creator>bulaman</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 25 Nov 2011 04:14:24 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.climateconversation.wordshine.co.nz/?p=11974#comment-71886</guid>
		<description>If this from the Daily mail is valid then that&#039;s all she wrote!

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sciencetech/article-2065954/Climate-change-fears-exaggerated-say-scientists-claim-apocalyptic-predictions-unlikely.html</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>If this from the Daily mail is valid then that&#8217;s all she wrote!</p>
<p><a href="http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sciencetech/article-2065954/Climate-change-fears-exaggerated-say-scientists-claim-apocalyptic-predictions-unlikely.html" rel="nofollow">http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sciencetech/article-2065954/Climate-change-fears-exaggerated-say-scientists-claim-apocalyptic-predictions-unlikely.html</a></p>
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